Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

2019 All-Stars (ASCoC) Season Thread

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Originally posted by Ross

    Ding! Ding! we have a winner.
    No sir what you have is a lie. My wife or I have nothing to do with it. But hey we are built for this **** we can take the blame. So now that I no longer have to be polictally correct how bout the truth on Tony and I.

    I was told we all we all would be treated the same and was told we could no longer have two day events paying $5000 to win each night. Then I go to Florida and it was okay there is I asked about it and Jared more less told me that it didn’t apply. I informed him that I felt that all that superstar power I felt would bring more to the table then what it did. They wanted to charge us $1000 for Tony to do a voice over inviting fans to our events. One would think that he would want to grow the series instead of just making the money. I told them things that they didn’t want to hear so they chose to make up that I wanted to take over speedweek and told Tony that and he of course had to buy into his workers and he and I had a terrible conversation that included many threats and so forth. There was a time when Webb was in charge I thought it would be best. And today I know it would be best. Remember when I was removed speedweek was set we had shows so the theory is false why would I have a agreement and try my own. I don’t regret it at all as I don’t see what he has done to help things grow. U all see the public show that his handlers put on for u not what really happens in the world. There is a reason not one team will be left from the start of the Tony era. I think it’s funny as **** that they have gone through so much hassle for one little small town guy. I have full documents showing that I own Thursday of Ohio Speedweek and a lawyer who is very much wanting to take it the distance the only thing stopping it is that I would never kill the tradition of that event for my own greed. So instead I tried to walk away and let them all have what they wish for but instead they continue to blame me for their flaws. So best wishes and hope u all get to see the real All Stars someday and the politics and bullying that happens behind the scenes. Think of how much better it would be if all the tracks who could host outlaw shows had one and Eldora had to run more all stars. There is a reason they dictate that stuff think about it. If that show was so good for the track the owner would host more. Think on that he can have the show cheaper than anyone. And if u think I am full of **** ur not a fan of the sport ur the fan of one man. The same man I was too once a big fan of too.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by TheAMain View Post
      Okay, I'll be that n00b. What exactly happened between Farmer and the All Stars?
      When guy webb who owned the ascoc before stewart he didn't charge sanctioning fees for both days of a 2 day show. let tracks pay 3k on Friday and 10k Saturday too. tony stewart bought ascoc after the drivers abandoned the ascoc and started their own series. tony wouldn't do the 2 day show without 2 sanctioning fees and 5k to win at least on both nights. farmer and him butted heads on that issue and the direction of sprint racing in the area. was a rumor about farmer trying to run a speedweek without the ascoc too. that's the story and im sure theres more to it.

      Comment


      • #33
        You are close the increase in a 2 day event was over $20000 for the weekend. It only effect Fremont and Attica the two most loyal tracks on the schedule. A cost that simply couldn’t be justified. Guy did charge a fee for both days but the first night was reduced about half. But face if no travel and so forth so the cost to the series was also about half.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Rich Farmer View Post
          You are close the increase in a 2 day event was over $20000 for the weekend. It only effect Fremont and Attica the two most loyal tracks on the schedule. A cost that simply couldn’t be justified. Guy did charge a fee for both days but the first night was reduced about half. But face if no travel and so forth so the cost to the series was also about half.
          Rich, appreciate you being able to give facts. Can you tell us how much the All Star Sanction fee is for one day, 2 day show, and then how much the WoO sprint sanction fee is? From those fees, how much of that fee goes toward the purse?

          Comment


          • #35
            Politics raises its ugly head.

            Sadly everyone seems to lose.

            JMO It seemingly feels like Eldora has kept the WoO shows away from other Ohio tracks which has left the tracks going to pick up All Star shows when they cant get a WoO. This is what I have always thought anyways since I used to watch WoO around other Ohio tracks from when my dad took me.

            Then if any one wants giggles currently showing up on my yahoo news feed was the headline of TS and his secret ED like a national enquirer. That is some crazy stuff unless it was a sponsor. Seemed funny cause of the timing.
            Last edited by RRacer70; November 29th, 2018, 10:18 PM.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by dzirzow View Post

              Rich, appreciate you being able to give facts. Can you tell us how much the All Star Sanction fee is for one day, 2 day show, and then how much the WoO sprint sanction fee is? From those fees, how much of that fee goes toward the purse?
              An All Star show with Webb worked out to $4500 per night and with the current last I knew was $9500 for a Normal show and $10500 for a speedweek event. The Speedweek part I never understood as the points fund was a laughable $3000. None of the sanctioning fees going toward purse it does go to tow money and the rest goes to the series for cost and profits. Don’t get me wrong profit isn’t a bad word it is just that what is enough profit? With the current fees and what I know on some other contingency deals one could pay $50000 in points for speedweek alone and still make $40000 plus profits for the week.

              The outlaws are are the top of the top and it is fair that it comes at a cost the entire show cost around $75000 with $45000 of that going to purse. But an All Star team gets 200 to 400 in tow and Outlaws get 1200 at least. So it matters. Like I said more Ohio tracks deserve that show. Wayne County, Atomic, Sharon, and Mansfield could all host that show but it is hostage therefore making the next level this only choice. If more promoters would realize that they can make way better money working as a unit as we all once did then this problem would solve its self. 10 years ago we were able to not book against one another have great events all over the state for fans to enjoy but when promoters are dictated to opposed to having that choice it created walls and so forth. The purses could raise the events could be less risk for the promoter allowing for fair ticket pricing.

              It is my true hope hope that someday local racing returns to being local racing and the promoters and teams benefit instead of the corporate greed that has now taken the reins.

              The direction of things at the The rate they are going the teams need to create a union type deal to better their end of the deal. It would help both them and promoters by having them invested in the growth in the ticket sales. But hey what do I know I am just one person with a passion for a great sport who has invested dearly into it.

              Comment


              • #37
                Rich, during an ASCoC or WoO event, what happens if the event gets rained out in relation to the sanction fee? Promoter lose all of it, partial, none if re-scheduled?


                Also, I think it would help this forum if you copied your Facebook posting. We all know not everyone will agree with everything or anyone (would be a boring life if we all were the same). I think you pulled back the curtain a little and would be helpful for discussion purposes on this thread without it getting to "whine cellar" material.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Swamp View Post
                  Also, I thought maybe they'd get over it with the Fremont BS, but Tony wants to hold a grudge...so be it. The series is suffering by snubbing the "Home of the All Stars" but whatever. What do I know...
                  I don't see the All-Stars suffering because of not having a race at Fremont. The All-Stars have had big-time crowds the past couple of years wherever they go and they have had a great/good following of cars/drivers/owners the past several years.

                  Originally posted by Blaniac1 View Post
                  I hate it that the fans of Fremont continue to be punished. I don’t care who was right or wrong, I just want All Star racing, at what used to be, the home of the All Stars. If what I heard about farmer not distancing himself is true, he will be around for at least a couple of more years because he still has a contract. So, if that’s true as well, I wouldn’t expect the All Stars to return anytime soon.
                  The fans aren't punished they can always go to Attica, Eldora, Wayne County, Mansfield, etc...

                  Originally posted by RRacer70 View Post
                  That is too bad for the Fremont crowd.
                  As above fans can go to other tracks that have the All-Stars. Not every tracks can have a WoO or All-Star show so those fans if they want to see them can go to those tracks.

                  Originally posted by mudinmybeer View Post

                  When guy webb who owned the ascoc before stewart he didn't charge sanctioning fees for both days of a 2 day show. let tracks pay 3k on Friday and 10k Saturday too. tony stewart bought ascoc after the drivers abandoned the ascoc and started their own series. tony wouldn't do the 2 day show without 2 sanctioning fees and 5k to win at least on both nights. farmer and him butted heads on that issue and the direction of sprint racing in the area. was a rumor about farmer trying to run a speedweek without the ascoc too. that's the story and im sure theres more to it.
                  The All-Stars raised fees which is likely a good thing for the fans/teams/drivers/owners because they also have a higher point fund by a big margin, a good tow packages for those teams, good contingencies for the teams, etc... People need to understand that when fees go up that is because it helps the betterment of the series which brings in better cars/owners/drivers for the entire series and with having the 2nd best purse in sprint car racing it helps bring in invaders to these events along with giving the locals a good payday if they of course make the feature over a normal local show. Also fees going up hurts the tracks, but with better teams/cars/drivers being part of the series it brings in more fans as well in most cases.
                  2019 Race Counter: 15
                  Tracks: Attica (3), Bubba (3), Eldora (1), Fremont (1), Mansfield (1), Sharon (1), Volusia (4), Wayne County (1).
                  DirtVision: 14.
                  Speedshift: 18.
                  Rain: Way to many to even count already!!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    The allstars are doing fine without fremont but the place deserves to be apart of speedweek etc... yea you can see the allstars at other tracks but fremont is a 410 weekly track and has been for a long time. So your telling me muskinghum deserves a speedweek date over fremont???? Muskinghum track is always a dust bowl and doesn't even compare to the quality of 410 show you get at Fremont. Do I go to muskinghum yes I do and are the shows good? yes they are but fremont is just better all the way around. Fans do get snubbed that are in the north- northwest of the state and southern michigan. no millstream these days either. I say we protest at some allstar shows this year with bring the allstars back to fremont banners and chants!!! If nobodys making any waves then the allstars are going to keep doing the same thing year in year out.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by dzirzow View Post
                      Rich, during an ASCoC or WoO event, what happens if the event gets rained out in relation to the sanction fee? Promoter lose all of it, partial, none if re-scheduled?


                      Also, I think it would help this forum if you copied your Facebook posting. We all know not everyone will agree with everything or anyone (would be a boring life if we all were the same). I think you pulled back the curtain a little and would be helpful for discussion purposes on this thread without it getting to "whine cellar" material.
                      In the past with the All Stars if was if heats were completed it was a full show and try to make up the features. With WoO there is a procedure that depends on how far along how much you paid. Both were always fair in that regards.

                      On the curtain comment. I will leave it where it is but will gladly share in my experiences over the past 12 years as a track owner and promoter. Both in ideas to move forward and the ugly behind that curtain.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by DirtRacer42 View Post

                        I don't see the All-Stars suffering because of not having a race at Fremont. The All-Stars have had big-time crowds the past couple of years wherever they go and they have had a great/good following of cars/drivers/owners the past several years.

                        This is true the All Stars don’t need Fremont and Fremont don’t need them. The non sanctioned events that we had with 5000 and 10000 to win events did just fine. This year it started out strong for them with teams but only 7 ended the season with them and it sounds that most have moved on to other things. 4 of the top 5 are gone.


                        The fans aren't punished they can always go to Attica, Eldora, Wayne County, Mansfield, etc...

                        Totally agree...

                        As above fans can go to other tracks that have the All-Stars. Not every tracks can have a WoO or All-Star show so those fans if they want to see them can go to those tracks.



                        The All-Stars raised fees which is likely a good thing for the fans/teams/drivers/owners because they also have a higher point fund by a big margin, a good tow packages for those teams, good contingencies for the teams, etc... People need to understand that when fees go up that is because it helps the betterment of the series which brings in better cars/owners/drivers for the entire series and with having the 2nd best purse in sprint car racing it helps bring in invaders to these events along with giving the locals a good payday if they of course make the feature over a normal local show. Also fees going up hurts the tracks, but with better teams/cars/drivers being part of the series it brings in more fans as well in most cases.
                        When the fees were raised the points in fact paid less the tow money was less as well. This past season things paid better. When you consider the fee increase with the sponsor increase that is brought to the table it is all still pretty weak considering Webb paid that money in the past also. The travel of the new all stars would more than consume the increase as well. All of this is likely why not one of the teams from the first year of the new all stars remain. Keep in mind most all of those cars are still racing just not with the series.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Rich Farmer View Post

                          No sir what you have is a lie. My wife or I have nothing to do with it. But hey we are built for this **** we can take the blame. So now that I no longer have to be polictally correct how bout the truth on Tony and I.

                          I was told we all we all would be treated the same and was told we could no longer have two day events paying $5000 to win each night. Then I go to Florida and it was okay there is I asked about it and Jared more less told me that it didn’t apply. I informed him that I felt that all that superstar power I felt would bring more to the table then what it did. They wanted to charge us $1000 for Tony to do a voice over inviting fans to our events. One would think that he would want to grow the series instead of just making the money. I told them things that they didn’t want to hear so they chose to make up that I wanted to take over speedweek and told Tony that and he of course had to buy into his workers and he and I had a terrible conversation that included many threats and so forth. There was a time when Webb was in charge I thought it would be best. And today I know it would be best. Remember when I was removed speedweek was set we had shows so the theory is false why would I have a agreement and try my own. I don’t regret it at all as I don’t see what he has done to help things grow. U all see the public show that his handlers put on for u not what really happens in the world. There is a reason not one team will be left from the start of the Tony era. I think it’s funny as **** that they have gone through so much hassle for one little small town guy. I have full documents showing that I own Thursday of Ohio Speedweek and a lawyer who is very much wanting to take it the distance the only thing stopping it is that I would never kill the tradition of that event for my own greed. So instead I tried to walk away and let them all have what they wish for but instead they continue to blame me for their flaws. So best wishes and hope u all get to see the real All Stars someday and the politics and bullying that happens behind the scenes. Think of how much better it would be if all the tracks who could host outlaw shows had one and Eldora had to run more all stars. There is a reason they dictate that stuff think about it. If that show was so good for the track the owner would host more. Think on that he can have the show cheaper than anyone. And if u think I am full of **** ur not a fan of the sport ur the fan of one man. The same man I was too once a big fan of too.
                          Few things about this that I still do not understand and I am legitimately asking about this so I do not want you to feel that I am being confrontational because you have been a promoter that will go on record and speak professionally even if fans are saying negative things about you or Fremont.

                          I can see the FL argument on both sides and the whole 2day show $5000 to win. On one hand I can see where that is something different because it is a little bit of an outlier show and outside of a region. On the other hand I can see your point because it is unfair for the supporting regional tracks to be held to a different standard. The $1000 thing though, was this a requirement to have done or could you simply have said no we are fine, Fremont pulls enough cars and fans anyway?

                          As far as the superstar power brining more to the table, what exactly do you mean by that? More fans, more cars, more money, less fees? From what I have seen a certain tracks, his name does bring in more fans although it is hard to verify exactly how many. Not sure $1000 dollar voice over is worth it or not. From what I have seen it appears that he has wanted to grow the series, however it may not be the way that you or other would have envisioned it. To me under Webb, the series was an Ohio based series with a couple trips to PA and sometimes out to the Great Plains. Under Stewart it seems he is trying to expand that territory and go to more tracks such as NY, Wisconsin, Illinois. Just seems like a difference in vision.

                          Not sure what you mean on the comment "There was a time when Webb was in charge I thought it would be best. And today I know it would be best." Are you saying that the way Webb was doing things was better? I would respectfully disagree with that sentiment as towards the end of his tenure it seemed like people were so angry with him that they would have much rather started their own series than run under him as well. There was also the whole payment issue that was going on and while I believe everyone did get paid, it was not on time. Also under his management the last few years I believe he only had about 3 or 4 cars running at the end of the year, and only Dale Blaney at the end of his last year. I know that under Webb things were probably better for Fremont with the amount of All Star races you had and at the discounted fee.

                          The one that puzzles me the most is the comment about if all tracks who could host an outlaw race had one instead of Eldora. Granted I am just a peon in this whole sprint car world. I am just a fan who pays his ticket money buys tee shirts and concessions etc, but I still do not understand if tracks have money to pay a sanctioning fee and a purse, how the outlaws would say no to them just because Tony Stewart is telling them not to. I have heard others talk about this to and I am still not sure if I believe this. Its a hard sale to say that a business will not take money when it is offered to them.

                          At the end of the day as I have said in other posts, I do not have a "local track" I live in the middle of the state and it takes me about 1.5hrs to get to any track. With owning part of a business myself, working full time, raising a family my time to go to the track is limited. The races I do go to are mainly Outlaw or All Star races because I know the car count will be good, the tracks will be good, the quality will good. I used to go to local shows before my son was born and I had more time but now, I cannot justify the drive for a weekly show and that is not a dig on the local racers. They are great drivers and great people and deserve any success they have. I do not think you are full of **** and at the same time I do not think the Stewart or the All stars are either. I am a fan of the sport and spend a lot of money each year on tix and try to go to as many shows as I can. The whole thing about incidents like this for me is being a race fan/customer/consumer is that I don't care about the behind the scenes B.S and politics that goes on. I care about the racing and I will go to the tracks/events that will give me the best of that.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            I wonder if the Movers and Packers in India want an All Star race.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by racemak View Post
                              I wonder if the Movers and Packers in India want an All Star race.
                              Not sure why you would care one way or another since you stay away from the All-Star/WoO shows anyway. You would think you would be happier knowing they aren't around as much.
                              2019 Race Counter: 15
                              Tracks: Attica (3), Bubba (3), Eldora (1), Fremont (1), Mansfield (1), Sharon (1), Volusia (4), Wayne County (1).
                              DirtVision: 14.
                              Speedshift: 18.
                              Rain: Way to many to even count already!!

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Rich Farmer View Post

                                When the fees were raised the points in fact paid less the tow money was less as well. This past season things paid better. When you consider the fee increase with the sponsor increase that is brought to the table it is all still pretty weak considering Webb paid that money in the past also. The travel of the new all stars would more than consume the increase as well. All of this is likely why not one of the teams from the first year of the new all stars remain. Keep in mind most all of those cars are still racing just not with the series.
                                I realize you was/is a big Webb fans, but come on man!

                                Webb tried to be a mini-WoO tour just as well with remembering the "plains tour" that was a complete failure and at a very bad time as well. His group was so disorganized that the local fans in Ohio could go watch most of the All-Stars at Attica on a weekly basis at times especially early in the season. I remember fans all over the internet complaining about it and say why go watch a all-star race and pay more money when you can watch them either the previous week or the following week at Attica for a local price.

                                At least this All-Star group when they go to a different area has 3-4 races that weekend so teams can get a pretty good chunk of tow money and also be able to race for good money as well.

                                The reason the tow money went down is because they had 15-19 drivers/teams at one time as well when the season started. When was the last time that Webb had any type of following over 5 cars/teams? Most use to joke it was the Dale Blaney series since he was basically the only one following it during that time. At the start of the past couple of years the All-Stars had nearly 20 cars that planned to start out with the All-Stars and see where it took them.

                                Teams move on, drivers move on, and fans move on it is part of racing. I know you want to make the All-Stars not that big of deal because you wanted your FAST series to be a mini-all-star series as you moved them away from the local scene just like your complaining about the all-stars doing. This past season for the All-Stars was one of the best in a very long time with the size of crowds, the HUGE car counts, the bigger names that either followed the season for all/most of the season along with the invaders that came and supported these events as well.
                                2019 Race Counter: 15
                                Tracks: Attica (3), Bubba (3), Eldora (1), Fremont (1), Mansfield (1), Sharon (1), Volusia (4), Wayne County (1).
                                DirtVision: 14.
                                Speedshift: 18.
                                Rain: Way to many to even count already!!

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X